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mkrishnan
Jul 27, 10:13 AM
Good Lord - does anybody know what the G5 is? I'd imagine that the elaborate cooling system in the current G5 towers probably won't be needed it it's running anything like the D's...
According to this article (http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/G5/xserveG5.html), a single, single core 2.0GHz 970FX consumes 12-45W, with an average consumption around 25.... An iMac G5 containing onesuch processor consumes about 90W altogether.
According to this article (http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/G5/xserveG5.html), a single, single core 2.0GHz 970FX consumes 12-45W, with an average consumption around 25.... An iMac G5 containing onesuch processor consumes about 90W altogether.
fastlane1588
Jul 27, 11:52 PM
so everyone keeps saying wwdc for all of the hardware releases....well seeing as how apple enjoys releasing stuff on tuesdays there happens to be a tuesday before wwdc. what if they just either quitely released everything or anounced everything that tuesday. that way they arent slow about releasing, and everyone will be set for when they talk about leopard and all the cool apps that they can run on their new machines,
this way they can also keep the focus of wwdc on the software instead of trying to squeeze new releases and software demos and all into one event......just a thought
this way they can also keep the focus of wwdc on the software instead of trying to squeeze new releases and software demos and all into one event......just a thought
Macnoviz
Jul 22, 03:03 AM
So I read in this thread that Kentsfield and Clovertown ARE compatible with Conroe and Woodcrest sockets (respectively) (Cloverton or Clovertown?)
Hope for upgrading an iMac to Quad Core is kindled! At least if Apple releases Conroe iMacs.
BTW, In my opinion, one thing a person should never, ever say is some computer has too much power, and that it will never be needed. So when 128 core CPUs come out in ~10 years time, will we still be considering dual core CPUs as fast enough for our use?
I seem to remember that when the original DOS operating system was created, its RAM was limited. I can't remember exactly to how much, but it was decided that people would never use more than a few kilobytes of memory. Now we are arguing that Mac should provide no less than a gigabyte! Now we are moving to 64 bit processing, with its capability to address a few exobytes, or millions of Terabytes of storage, it seems impossible that we will ever need 128bit computing. But, no doubt, one day we will.
When we will be able to download our entire lives, and even conciousness into a computer, as is said to happen in about 40 years (very much looking forward to), I dare say it will take a lot of memory to do, and even more processing power to manage effectively, especially if we wanted to "live" inside computers, as we will no doubt want to do someday.
So as a conclusion to my most recent rant, Please, never tell me a computer is too powerfu, has too many cores, or has too much storage capacity. If it is there to be used, it will be used. It always is.
I agree with your point on never saying a computer is too powerful, although living in computers is probably not going to happen. Sounds a bit too Matrix-like for me.
Hope for upgrading an iMac to Quad Core is kindled! At least if Apple releases Conroe iMacs.
BTW, In my opinion, one thing a person should never, ever say is some computer has too much power, and that it will never be needed. So when 128 core CPUs come out in ~10 years time, will we still be considering dual core CPUs as fast enough for our use?
I seem to remember that when the original DOS operating system was created, its RAM was limited. I can't remember exactly to how much, but it was decided that people would never use more than a few kilobytes of memory. Now we are arguing that Mac should provide no less than a gigabyte! Now we are moving to 64 bit processing, with its capability to address a few exobytes, or millions of Terabytes of storage, it seems impossible that we will ever need 128bit computing. But, no doubt, one day we will.
When we will be able to download our entire lives, and even conciousness into a computer, as is said to happen in about 40 years (very much looking forward to), I dare say it will take a lot of memory to do, and even more processing power to manage effectively, especially if we wanted to "live" inside computers, as we will no doubt want to do someday.
So as a conclusion to my most recent rant, Please, never tell me a computer is too powerfu, has too many cores, or has too much storage capacity. If it is there to be used, it will be used. It always is.
I agree with your point on never saying a computer is too powerful, although living in computers is probably not going to happen. Sounds a bit too Matrix-like for me.
xxBURT0Nxx
Apr 7, 09:26 AM
ok don't be as ass! back-lit keyboard on the 13' but not the 11' would be heartbreaking for those of us who wants the 11 and will make the decision making between the two even harder..
yes posting DREAM spec's for a machine that he really knows absolutely nothing about makes him an ass because it is not your dream spec sheet:confused: some people these days... smh:rolleyes:
yes posting DREAM spec's for a machine that he really knows absolutely nothing about makes him an ass because it is not your dream spec sheet:confused: some people these days... smh:rolleyes:
Kristenn
Mar 31, 10:33 PM
Good. I hope they take one of the last strengths of the iPad ecosystem away from it.
Wow, your username might be Full of Win (lol...) But this post is Full of Fail!
Care to explain? I mean, I don't get it. It seems like only the iHaters would understand this post or just pretend to so they can shout I AGREE!
I'm serious. Explain, please?
Wow, your username might be Full of Win (lol...) But this post is Full of Fail!
Care to explain? I mean, I don't get it. It seems like only the iHaters would understand this post or just pretend to so they can shout I AGREE!
I'm serious. Explain, please?
Huntn
Mar 18, 08:59 PM
Back in Ron Paul warned us about Barack Obama and the fact that his foreign policy would almost certainly essentially mirror that of the Democrats and Neo-Cons for the past 60 years.
I am very unhappy that Obama did not get us out of a state of War. Which pacifist do you plan on voting for this next time around?
I am very unhappy that Obama did not get us out of a state of War. Which pacifist do you plan on voting for this next time around?
mac1984user
Apr 27, 08:33 AM
Apple's solution is fine by me. They wouldn't have done anything if there wasn't so much press about it, but I guess that's a good reason (one of the only ones) for the press to exist. Still, they all managed to get it a bit wrong, though. I noticed (like so many others out there), that the map wasn't recording my EXACT location, but just cell towers and wifi spots I may have accessed. The info didn't really bother me. It wasn't like it had me pegged at my local pub - or did it?!?! =)
nikhsub1
Apr 7, 10:20 PM
Wow. I bought mine at Best Buy on opening day and they sold out of them. Why in anybody's right mind would best buy not sell what they have?
Obviously you know little about retail and accounting.
Obviously you know little about retail and accounting.
xPismo
Jul 14, 07:47 PM
WWDC ... it's getting closer ... can't wait to see what's announced. Oh yeah ... we'll see the preview of Leopard too.
Bring it on Steve :D
Yeah. I don't believe a word. No powercord at the top, no tweaked G5 case, no way. Those bits throw the rest into dispute. I think we will all be shocked at what The Steve has for us at wwdc.
OTOH, its been great to finally read the benchmark figures for the new apple processors. It hit me that the mac community will finally have overclocking hardware readily available! Wow!
But this rumor just dosn't look or smell right.
Bring it on Steve :D
Yeah. I don't believe a word. No powercord at the top, no tweaked G5 case, no way. Those bits throw the rest into dispute. I think we will all be shocked at what The Steve has for us at wwdc.
OTOH, its been great to finally read the benchmark figures for the new apple processors. It hit me that the mac community will finally have overclocking hardware readily available! Wow!
But this rumor just dosn't look or smell right.
DocNo
Apr 11, 10:24 AM
I think they want to make FCP a tool for consumers who have no idea about narrative structure and storytelling.
So wouldn't that make the recent pushes with iMovie, particularly on the iOS redundant? That' doesn't seem a very smart use of resources or use of branding...
FCP isn't useful for Apple any more.
Really? Had lunch with SJ lately? Care to share more?
Regarding editing conventions, they are far older then 20 or so years. However, they've been around for a very long time and those conventions will be here to stay. Why? Because in the end of the day stories are linear and that fact won't change one bit even if Apple releases iMovie Pro.
I guess time will tell. I remember reading comments like yours from industry "experts" when I first started playing around with PageMaker 1.0 on my school's Mac Plus - dismissing it as a toy and not a serious or professional tool.
Perhaps "old timers" problems like yours is that you have been in your box for so long that you can't possibly imagine how it could be different and useful? The panel touched on that - I think it was in Part 2. It was fun to see who embraced that notation and which members of the panel dismissed it (either verbally or by their body language).
Final thought: evolve or die; be prepared to get out of your comfort zone. Heck, you might even like it!
So wouldn't that make the recent pushes with iMovie, particularly on the iOS redundant? That' doesn't seem a very smart use of resources or use of branding...
FCP isn't useful for Apple any more.
Really? Had lunch with SJ lately? Care to share more?
Regarding editing conventions, they are far older then 20 or so years. However, they've been around for a very long time and those conventions will be here to stay. Why? Because in the end of the day stories are linear and that fact won't change one bit even if Apple releases iMovie Pro.
I guess time will tell. I remember reading comments like yours from industry "experts" when I first started playing around with PageMaker 1.0 on my school's Mac Plus - dismissing it as a toy and not a serious or professional tool.
Perhaps "old timers" problems like yours is that you have been in your box for so long that you can't possibly imagine how it could be different and useful? The panel touched on that - I think it was in Part 2. It was fun to see who embraced that notation and which members of the panel dismissed it (either verbally or by their body language).
Final thought: evolve or die; be prepared to get out of your comfort zone. Heck, you might even like it!
BC2009
Apr 11, 02:15 PM
I'm in this boat to. I'm noticing my battery life is deteriorating also - never owned an iPhone this long. Also my GF has Verison Droid that just kicks my ass; better reception, faster, cool apps -e.g. voice to SMS. I can wait until July but late fall? IDK.
Are you serious? The Moto Droid (i.e.: the original one) is slower than molasses. You cannot be talking about the original Verizon Droid. That phone under-delivered out the gate. My friend from work whose entire family uses Verizon bought a Motorola Droid and she thought she was getting the equivalent of an iPhone and hated it ever since. She was jumping up and down when Verizon got the iPhone.
Maybe, just maybe, a Verizon Motorola Droid, rooted and with the latest stable version of Gingerbread installed you can get decent performance and responsiveness, but certainly not with an approved Froyo update running on it.
I sure hope you are talking about a newer "Verizon Droid" phone -- some of those are nice, but I still would not trade the Apple user experience for the Android experience -- though I hate having to wait until Sep/Oct.
As a side note, I laughed heartily last night when my sister-in-law asked if I had Angry Birds on my iPhone or iPad because her mom loved that game. Her husband, my wife's brother, who owns a Motorola Droid and a Xoom and is a huge Android enthusiast promptly answered her saying "that Angry Birds is only available on Android". I proceeded to show him the number of "Angry Birds" games available on iOS. Made me realize that Android enthusiasts often don't know that there is something better out there, and yet Apple enthusiasts are called "ignorant, stupid, and sheep". His response was to show me an app he had that could automatically throttle his CPU down to save battery when the phone was not in heavy use. I admitted that I did not have that capability, but that I also did not need it. The moral of the story was, if you want really useful apps and games and fantastic user experience and tight integration with a suite of great (albeit sometimes expensive) products, then you buy Apple. If you want a heterogenous computing environment, your greatest apps to come from Google, and the ability to throttle the clock-speed on your smartphone's CPU, then Android is for you.
I think it is very telling that last week (http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9215598/Clorox_cleans_out_BlackBerries_in_favor_of_iPhones_Android_devices?taxonomyId=154&pageNumber=1) when Clorox CIO offered 2000 Clorox employees the option to switch off Blackberry and get an iPhone, Android or Win Phone 7 device on the company's dime to replace their Blackberry device, that 92% of those 2000 employees chose a 10-month-old iPhone 4, with only 6% choosing Android, and 2% choosing WP7. Google would have you believe that people prefer Android. The truth of the matter is that the people who don't care about having a smartphone or not just choose the best "free phone" or BOGO option that the carrier offers -- if that option happens to be Android, then sure Android commands a greater market share of the growing smartphone market. Those customers will never care what their mobile OS is -- they were just looking to get what they could for free (or cheap). Its like asking somebody if they would prefer the Honda or Hyundai -- most would prefer the Honda, but many may settle for the Hyundai if it is cheaper. But when you take cost out of the equation then the story changes. The moral of that story is that Apple needs a cheaper entry point for an iOS smartphone if they want to command market share and especially to put their phones in the hands of more teenagers.
Are you serious? The Moto Droid (i.e.: the original one) is slower than molasses. You cannot be talking about the original Verizon Droid. That phone under-delivered out the gate. My friend from work whose entire family uses Verizon bought a Motorola Droid and she thought she was getting the equivalent of an iPhone and hated it ever since. She was jumping up and down when Verizon got the iPhone.
Maybe, just maybe, a Verizon Motorola Droid, rooted and with the latest stable version of Gingerbread installed you can get decent performance and responsiveness, but certainly not with an approved Froyo update running on it.
I sure hope you are talking about a newer "Verizon Droid" phone -- some of those are nice, but I still would not trade the Apple user experience for the Android experience -- though I hate having to wait until Sep/Oct.
As a side note, I laughed heartily last night when my sister-in-law asked if I had Angry Birds on my iPhone or iPad because her mom loved that game. Her husband, my wife's brother, who owns a Motorola Droid and a Xoom and is a huge Android enthusiast promptly answered her saying "that Angry Birds is only available on Android". I proceeded to show him the number of "Angry Birds" games available on iOS. Made me realize that Android enthusiasts often don't know that there is something better out there, and yet Apple enthusiasts are called "ignorant, stupid, and sheep". His response was to show me an app he had that could automatically throttle his CPU down to save battery when the phone was not in heavy use. I admitted that I did not have that capability, but that I also did not need it. The moral of the story was, if you want really useful apps and games and fantastic user experience and tight integration with a suite of great (albeit sometimes expensive) products, then you buy Apple. If you want a heterogenous computing environment, your greatest apps to come from Google, and the ability to throttle the clock-speed on your smartphone's CPU, then Android is for you.
I think it is very telling that last week (http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9215598/Clorox_cleans_out_BlackBerries_in_favor_of_iPhones_Android_devices?taxonomyId=154&pageNumber=1) when Clorox CIO offered 2000 Clorox employees the option to switch off Blackberry and get an iPhone, Android or Win Phone 7 device on the company's dime to replace their Blackberry device, that 92% of those 2000 employees chose a 10-month-old iPhone 4, with only 6% choosing Android, and 2% choosing WP7. Google would have you believe that people prefer Android. The truth of the matter is that the people who don't care about having a smartphone or not just choose the best "free phone" or BOGO option that the carrier offers -- if that option happens to be Android, then sure Android commands a greater market share of the growing smartphone market. Those customers will never care what their mobile OS is -- they were just looking to get what they could for free (or cheap). Its like asking somebody if they would prefer the Honda or Hyundai -- most would prefer the Honda, but many may settle for the Hyundai if it is cheaper. But when you take cost out of the equation then the story changes. The moral of that story is that Apple needs a cheaper entry point for an iOS smartphone if they want to command market share and especially to put their phones in the hands of more teenagers.
Auax
Apr 12, 10:11 PM
It is said that some important features will be achieved on iOS 5. So i will keep waiting and expecting the magic on iPhone 5.
yoak
Apr 12, 07:25 AM
I'm on a 2006 Mac Pro 2.66GHz.
I never set up QMaster. It's installed, but I never touched it. Mpeg2 (highest quality double pass) saturates all cores.
EDIT: sending to compressor from the timeline doesn't change. FCP and compressor together use 350% CPU (400% max).
Very interesting, could you check your batch monitor to see if it uses every core to compress?.
I think maybe we are talking past each other and it�s my mistake. For Compressor to use all of the machines CORES you have to do what I described. This speeds up the rendering times as every core work at 80-90%, each core rendering a chunk (1/8) of the file.
I never set up QMaster. It's installed, but I never touched it. Mpeg2 (highest quality double pass) saturates all cores.
EDIT: sending to compressor from the timeline doesn't change. FCP and compressor together use 350% CPU (400% max).
Very interesting, could you check your batch monitor to see if it uses every core to compress?.
I think maybe we are talking past each other and it�s my mistake. For Compressor to use all of the machines CORES you have to do what I described. This speeds up the rendering times as every core work at 80-90%, each core rendering a chunk (1/8) of the file.
Deefuzz
Nov 17, 09:00 AM
a rather dissapointing car list .. what gives with not a single newer model from VW than 2005 ? hardly any new alfas, no audi a1, a5, a7 ? no fiat 500 abarth ?
in general having old models instead of new ones at european car makers ? apart of lambo and ferrari few classic cars from european car makers added ?
so they neither added old cars and hardly any new european cars but instead mostly kept the car models from 1998-2004 period ... a big dissapointment
Actually I have to agree with this. There are somewhere around 1000 cars on the list, and some of the choices are confusing. No V series Cadillacs (only 1 Cadillac total actually) yet there are a crap ton of Nissan Skylines.
Hopefully they will fill in some of the roster with DLC, but then there's the issue of pumping more money into a game for content that should have been included from the start.
I still have it preordered and very much look forward to it, but the car list is a little confusing and disappointing.
in general having old models instead of new ones at european car makers ? apart of lambo and ferrari few classic cars from european car makers added ?
so they neither added old cars and hardly any new european cars but instead mostly kept the car models from 1998-2004 period ... a big dissapointment
Actually I have to agree with this. There are somewhere around 1000 cars on the list, and some of the choices are confusing. No V series Cadillacs (only 1 Cadillac total actually) yet there are a crap ton of Nissan Skylines.
Hopefully they will fill in some of the roster with DLC, but then there's the issue of pumping more money into a game for content that should have been included from the start.
I still have it preordered and very much look forward to it, but the car list is a little confusing and disappointing.
dmkidd
Mar 26, 12:05 AM
Yes come on summer! Daddy is waiting!!
Flippies
Apr 8, 04:40 AM
Final Cut Playmobil for the reel editors
http://www.thinkgeek.com/interests/looflirpa/e8bb/
http://www.thinkgeek.com/interests/looflirpa/e8bb/
powers74
Apr 10, 08:39 PM
Or make a lot of people happy. Either way everyone's going to be paying attention.
Lethal
Well, yeah, it will probably make more people happy, but it will be fun to see all the people bitching and moaning around here.
Lethal
Well, yeah, it will probably make more people happy, but it will be fun to see all the people bitching and moaning around here.
john123
Sep 19, 09:33 AM
Addressing larger RAM partitions is not the #1 advantage for me. I will not be putting >4GB of memory into my laptop. And I suspect it is not the #1 advantage for most of the people posting in this thread. If you don't like the subject matter of this thread, then don't read it. Simple as that.
You're so wrong. Most people posting in this thread don't have a clue what 64 bit computing really means. They just think they have to have it because it's the newest thing.
You're so wrong. Most people posting in this thread don't have a clue what 64 bit computing really means. They just think they have to have it because it's the newest thing.
afrowq
Apr 8, 11:03 PM
Coming from a full-time, multimedia/journalism/photography/etc professional I have to totally and completely
AGREE!
I've seen a huge decline in Apple's interest in the professional market, and I don't even mean high end pro, we're talking SMB and SOHO type stuff here. The last revision of FCP was just not worth it unless you were buying new or buying to ensure you didn't have any left over bugs.
Avid Media Composer and Premier have gained massive leads on FCP in terms of workflow and speed. Once the younger college students start seeing how fast they can delivery a product with Adobe or Avid, they'll start wondering why the small houses switched to FCP in the first place, and start wanting to learn what the industry is working with . . . Avid, After Effects, ProTools, etc. And the iMovie Pro will be left to indie filmmakers and consumers with deep pockets
** disclaimer ** I have nothing against the indie segment . . . I am in it and love it. But Apple makes it harder with every update to justify staying with a company that has too much on it's plate, and not enough staff to keep up with the rest of the market.
Apple will always claim that "no one's buying it" rather than, "we didn't make it marketable and desirable" when they go to axe some hardware or software title.
Careful, some trolls will insist that your opinion is only relevant to your narrow world view and that you need itemized spreadsheets to prove that you know what you're talking about.
AGREE!
I've seen a huge decline in Apple's interest in the professional market, and I don't even mean high end pro, we're talking SMB and SOHO type stuff here. The last revision of FCP was just not worth it unless you were buying new or buying to ensure you didn't have any left over bugs.
Avid Media Composer and Premier have gained massive leads on FCP in terms of workflow and speed. Once the younger college students start seeing how fast they can delivery a product with Adobe or Avid, they'll start wondering why the small houses switched to FCP in the first place, and start wanting to learn what the industry is working with . . . Avid, After Effects, ProTools, etc. And the iMovie Pro will be left to indie filmmakers and consumers with deep pockets
** disclaimer ** I have nothing against the indie segment . . . I am in it and love it. But Apple makes it harder with every update to justify staying with a company that has too much on it's plate, and not enough staff to keep up with the rest of the market.
Apple will always claim that "no one's buying it" rather than, "we didn't make it marketable and desirable" when they go to axe some hardware or software title.
Careful, some trolls will insist that your opinion is only relevant to your narrow world view and that you need itemized spreadsheets to prove that you know what you're talking about.
DocNo
Apr 11, 10:06 AM
I still think tape cameras are the best in quality, but the practicality of recording on a card or a hard drive will soon beat that.
I think Apple's timing with tomorrow is perfect for them to capitalize on this. If you watched the first two clips, the panelists talked about the lack of real standards for data and more importantly meta-data for file based workflows. They also referenced the only factory in the world that produces the most commonly used tape in pro workflow as being wiped out by the Tsunami in Japan - if Apple follows up with a new standard for file based workflow (which I fully expect them to do - skating to where the puck will be - it's a no brainer) and with Thunderbolt and a few manufacturers ready to capitalize it, I think you could see a dramatic shift in workflow since the tape situation will get dire for many. As one of the panelists pointed out, people aren't going to stop creating content just because they can't get more tape.
This might be the external catalyst that causes a dramatic shift. They are rare, but they do happen and events certainly seem to be lining up!
(I can't wait for the eventual conspiracy theorists that will no doubt claim SJ engineered the Tsunami in order to take advantage of it :rolleyes: )
I think Apple's timing with tomorrow is perfect for them to capitalize on this. If you watched the first two clips, the panelists talked about the lack of real standards for data and more importantly meta-data for file based workflows. They also referenced the only factory in the world that produces the most commonly used tape in pro workflow as being wiped out by the Tsunami in Japan - if Apple follows up with a new standard for file based workflow (which I fully expect them to do - skating to where the puck will be - it's a no brainer) and with Thunderbolt and a few manufacturers ready to capitalize it, I think you could see a dramatic shift in workflow since the tape situation will get dire for many. As one of the panelists pointed out, people aren't going to stop creating content just because they can't get more tape.
This might be the external catalyst that causes a dramatic shift. They are rare, but they do happen and events certainly seem to be lining up!
(I can't wait for the eventual conspiracy theorists that will no doubt claim SJ engineered the Tsunami in order to take advantage of it :rolleyes: )
Multimedia
Jul 21, 01:51 PM
Yes, with the possibility of a Mac Pro with 8 core on the horizon, it makes sense to skip the 4 core altogether. Or, start with lower end of 4 cores (say 2GHz) and then, if necessary and possible, upgrade it to 8 cores. I wonder if waiting for 8 cores is going to be a common sentiment. In that case, it would make sense for Apple to offer an upgrade path to it.There may be unknown variables supporting 8 cores from 4 such that I would not want to take that path. I would rather have 8 cores on a new motherboard with faster ram etc supported to get the most out of all of them at newer faster speeds.
mikeapple
Apr 7, 10:58 PM
Best Buy as ALWAYS been really ****** to the customer...
Always had run-ins with workers there and the management always takes the side of the rude sales person... SCREW YOU BEST BUY.. I hope Apple pulls out
Always had run-ins with workers there and the management always takes the side of the rude sales person... SCREW YOU BEST BUY.. I hope Apple pulls out
Maltz
Apr 27, 10:52 AM
I thought looking at my location histories was interesting. I, too, have no delusions that I cannot be tracked (cell phone, credit card purchases, etc.) I wonder if all the paranoids realize that any GPS camera encodes that information in the image. Share that photo online and anyone can get the metadata with location of photograph.
You wanna be connected, you can't be truly anonymous.
You wanna be anonymous, sell you computer, smart phone, cut up credit cards, and move to an undocumented shack in the middle of nowhere with no utilities.
The difference is a question of access. To get at the records kept by your cell phone provider, you need a subpoena. Any roommate/guest/thief/stalker with access to your computer or iPhone can get the data off your iphone or the backup as it exists right now. I don't mind the former, but I want to do everything I can to prevent the latter.
You wanna be connected, you can't be truly anonymous.
You wanna be anonymous, sell you computer, smart phone, cut up credit cards, and move to an undocumented shack in the middle of nowhere with no utilities.
The difference is a question of access. To get at the records kept by your cell phone provider, you need a subpoena. Any roommate/guest/thief/stalker with access to your computer or iPhone can get the data off your iphone or the backup as it exists right now. I don't mind the former, but I want to do everything I can to prevent the latter.
flopticalcube
Apr 27, 09:33 AM
So many critical issues to discuss and serious problems to overcome and people are still talking about ********** birth certificates? :rolleyes: